Kickstarter slipping on Ct70H

Hey guys need some help here, pulled the motor out of an H model to put in new shifter shaft seal, so I split the case and changed the seals, everything inside looked good, put it all back together and she fired right up, ran it for a while, drove it around without any problems, started it a few more times once again no problems, kicked over normally. Now today it starts slipping, no resistance at all. Also a little play in the shaft, it will catch every once in a while and start, but seems to be getting worse, first time messing with the H model! Help!! What did I screw up?

The first screw up was removing the clutch side cover, you can remove the seal from the outside. No need to remove the cover.. You should have thrown in some new clucth plates and cleaned the oil spinner.

I didnt remove the clutch side cover, just the mag side then split the case

So your saying I shouldn't have split the case, just take the shifter off and pull the seal off and replace?

It was the shifter shaft seal that was leaking oil

there's lots of ways to skin a cat. That said, even with all the animal cruelty and probably a forearm full of scratches, your shift shaft will probably still leak.

If i had to ONLY replace the shift shaft seal, i would grab a pick, or a seal removal tool, and sneak the seal out, without removing the shaft. probably do this with minimal oil or bike leaned over to right. make sure the shift shaft is clean and void of sharp edges (aside from the splines). Remove the old seal. Clean the shaft carefully, and well. Put some heavy oil on the sealing surface of the seal, prior to install. DO NOT TWIST THE SEAL when it's on the splined section of the shaft, because you'll wreck it before it even has a chance. Slide it straight on, until it hit the smooth section of the shaft. Clean the case surface with solvent to keep oil out, not that it REALLY matters, it's a tight fit. Make sure the seal isn't going in cocked (into the case) which is difficult to do anyways. tap it in with a hammer and dowel or similar.

done.

Should of asked first I guess, so now what is my kickstart problem?

Start with the basics; What type of oil did you put back in?

383bull said:

So your saying I shouldn't have split the case, just take the shifter off and pull the seal off and replace?

Click to expand...

Yes, I would clean the shaft where the seal rides put a little axle grease on the seal and one wrap of electrical tape on the splines so you don't damage the seal. Sorry I thought it was the clutch side. My doorbell was ringing here. LOL! Shift shaft seal is the same deal though. Dan brings up a great point about using wet clutch oil only. If you cant tweak the clutch cable adjustment then it is time to buy the clutch nut tool and replace the 2 fiber clutch discs. Clean all the gunk out of the clutch face. It's under the 4 JIS screws.

Did you install the thrust washer back in the correct location for the kick shaft when you split the case? There is one way of knowing if you didn't, you would actually be able to pull the kickshaft out a couple inches when you grab and pull on it.

Pat brought up a good point regarding the C-clip that retains the kickstart shaft. If you can pull the shaft out, as he described, you're going back inside the cases...no choice/no doubt. Order a new C-clip, first; it should never be reused, once removed.

There's another possibility lurking inside the cases, the friction spring (that's supposed to be) on the kickstart pinion gear. If it got knocked-off during reassembly, then you're relying on inertia to move the pinion gear far enough to engage. There's an easy way to test for this. Lean the bike waaaay over toward the LH side, then attempt kicking-over the motor by hand. If it grabs positively, every time, you've found your problem. A less reliable test is moving the kickstart lever by hand, as quickly as you can. While not as destructive as slap-kicking, by foot, it still puts a huge shock load on the gear teeth so don't do this more than once or twice, as a verification test.

One thing that's still unclear to me, is whether you mean that the kickstarter has no load, when moved, or if it feels kinda rubbery...that would indicate clutch slip.

Thanks for all the advice, no load at all on the kickstart shaft, I bet I have started it 20 times since I reassembled the motor, then this morning for the first time it slipped with no load, then started the next kick normally, did this a few more times, now nothing, I will mess with it tomorrow, thanks again for the help

Jackpot Racerx! Lean the bike left and it catches and kicks over normally, lean it right and nothing, so I guess it's gonna get split again, is there a trick to making sure that friction spring stays in place when you reassemble? I know it was on the shaft when I put it back together

Have seen people try to start these little 70's like they're trying to start a 250cc 2 stroke after a wipe out on the last lap in a motocross race. The slower you can kick them the better. On a cold motor I've seen clutches slip when trying to kick motor over, kick it slower and it will grab and start. You still might have a issue, (wore plates, mis-adjusted clutch, wrong oil, something assembled wrong) but the softer you can kick the motor over the better. I can start a motor with 120-150 pounds of compression with my hand. Just got to find the compression stroke by slowly kicking it over, when it gets to the "hard" part kick it somewhat harder. The clutch can't be pulled in when trying to start a H motor... surprised me the first time I tried it.