Exact matching Numbers KO

ifirefight

New Member
Apparently my 70KO is an exact matching numbers bike. How many have you seen? I know they are usually a few numbers off.
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69ST

Well-Known Member
It's rare but did happen. I've seen less than a handful, over the past two decades.

BTW, looks like this bike is still pretty clean. VIN tags and, especially, paint of this era don't often survive into the 21st century with this kind of vibrancy...nice.(y)
 

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
Pretty dang cool WarnerSteel! Do you think tho 2 parts came together right from Honda?? Barn find kinda bike? Or did you, or someone else, pair them from different sources? I once found a engine to match my frame, or vice versa, on a HK0, within 2 or 3.

If you honestly believe they came on the same bike...I think that will be the first time I've seen a dead match.
 

red69

Well-Known Member
I would think the only way that would be possible (dead match), would be at the beginning of a model year. To me, it looks like too many frames hit the dumpster for engines and frame numbers to match anywhere outside the initial model year start-up.

Bob
 

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
I would think there could have been multiple opportunities to start with a matched bike.

I guarantee Honda didn't build a CT70 plant, or a dedicated CT70 production line. They would have run CT70s on the same line as Z50s, CB750s, and a bunch of others. So they might have ran CT70s for a few days at a time. Each time they began production they would have been looking to start with a close match. And each time they started stamping numbers on a new batch of parts, they would have began stamping with matching numbers.

I don't believe you can count every Vin number as a bike produced. If the highest Vin K0 is 325000, I'll bet only 85% of those actually came out the back door as completed bikes.
 

cjpayne

Well-Known Member
From what I've gathered over the years, it was because of quality issues. For example, a motor would have something wrong and it would be sent back. Then the next motor would be grabbed to keep production going. They were pumping out ALOT of bikes.lol
 

69ST

Well-Known Member
AFAIK, the highest CT70K0 VIN is a little shy of 29xxxx. Stamping VINs has always been serious business and service replacement frames were never VIN-stamped. Thus it would make no sense, logistically, to have a separate line...or try to schedule a time to crank out service replacement frames. And cranking out hundreds of bikes per day would be more than enough to justify a dedicated line. Aside from fasteners, the number of parts that are the same for a CB750 & CT70 can probably be counted on one hand.

Far more likely that the frames & engines were ordered (internally) in batch lots. Under that scenario, a "pool" of 300-500 units (to keep the numbers reasonably close) is logical for a number of reasons. It also explains the number spread we've seen...easily.
 

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
We have NO lines here in the metal fab that only make one part. They swap in different dies and tooling, multiple times per day...truck fenders before lunch, Volt hoods after lunch, body sides on 2nd shift. We only have 6 lines of presses in the entire building, but we have hundreds of dies. On the assembly line, I would imagine they would mostly just need to swap out sockets sizes, and parts bins to run a different bike down the line. Every bike has the same parts to be assembled, they're just different shapes and sizes.
 

red69

Well-Known Member
And each time they started stamping numbers on a new batch of parts, they would have began stamping with matching numbers.

So what happened to the leftover stamped parts from the previous run that were not used?
That does not make sense to me.
 

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
Scrap.
It's cheaper, faster, easier to make a new frame, than to repair one that is welded together poorly...painted poorly, etc. A engine on the other hand could be disassembled, then reassembled, fairly easily.
 

red69

Well-Known Member
So how do the frames catch up and get even with the engine numbers? I would assume the frames scrapped carry their numbers with them.
 
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