clymer repair manual

mark from florida

Active Member
My wife just bought me a Clymer repair manual. just wondering is this the one to use for a complete rebuild/stroker motor? lists all honda singles form 1965-1999. it has the xl and sl 70 also. im thinking this should include a 4 speed trans. any feedback would be appreciated before I tear the wrapper off.
 

69ST

Well-Known Member
It's a remarkably complete reference...but...also very confusing, in places, to those who lack experience with these machines. Consider the logistical challenges of covering every model that falls under those displacement limits, manufactured over a 35-year span. There are multiple versions, i.e. running changes, for each of them...and...the 89cc-110cc engines are a completely different "family" (i.e. architecture) with no interchangeable parts. It might come across as having a bad attitude toward the Clymer book, it's not. They've done a remarkable job cramming a huge amount of information into the page space available and keeping the price reasonable. Where it comes up a little short is in specific details. This book is worth having in your library. That said, there are additional materials that can make life a LOT easier.

Building a stroker motor isn't all that different than a stock rebuild, in terms of assembly. The specific details or what goes with what are not covered in any book; fortunately, there are a limited number of assemblies where this will be a concern.
  • Alternator...flywheel, stator assembly, crankshaft type (3-speed, 4-speed, 12v)...must be used as a complete assembly. Each crank has a specific taper to fit a specific flywheel type
  • 4-speed alternators are either Hitachi or Mitsubishi (flywheel and stator assembly)...no parts interchange between them.
  • Transmission...3-speed or 4-speed...must be used as a complete assembly
  • Clutch...manual or semi-automatic...must be used as a complete assembly (clutch, release mechanism, shifter shaft assembly, outer cover)
If you source your new crank to match your flywheel, installing a stroker crank is no different than installing a stocker. It can be that simple & straightforward.

The "trickiest" stuff will be keeping the thrust washers straight, on the tranny and installation of the high-volume oil pump. Best bet is the Honda parts manual. Those exploded drawings show the locations of the thrust washers, dowel pins and top end O-rings. The Clymer manual will have the torque specs, point gap, and fluid capacities, along with wear specs (which shouldn't come into play with all-new reciprocating assembly parts.

Unless you're going with a 54mm bore or/and stroke, or going to 12v/CDI you won't need much more info than the aforementioned resources provide. Source your parts from a known vendor who can answer questions, should the need arise. The rest you can ask here.
 

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
When I first bought my clymers, I basically read thru it...everything that applied to Z50 and CT70's at least, twice.
By reading it cover to cover, AFTER I was already somewhat familiar with those bikes, I learned a lot...AND I also realized how the information had been organized in the book.
The information is there, but you have to be able to find it when you need it. I think it's a necessary tool to have if you're a Mini Trail guy.
The most of the challenge when you build a stroker, comes AFTER the engine is built. Carb/intake, exhaust, oil cooler, suspension and braking, will all have to be sorted, to do it right...or best.
As soon as you stray from stock parts, you are on your own, or, relying on the experience and advice of others.
The forums will be a big help.
The vendors can be a great help too. Buying a "kit" from a good vendor insures that everything can be made to work.

A stroker motor is worth the effort...for sure.
 

69ST

Well-Known Member
What I found confusing about Clymer's was some of their nomenclature. For example, how would anyone lacking experience be able to figure out if the clutch is ""type III"?...or if the photo/drawing was different/correct for their application?

It is worth mentioning that, anyone with some basic mechanical skills can navigate an engine build/rebuild...it will just be slower. As with any machinery, Honda engines have their little quirks and specific procedures. With experience, it gets a lot easier. Without experience, it can still be done, with great results...by tackling one part/assembly/issue at a time. I'd be surprised if you don't find anything that's at least a little perplexing, temporarily. That's where test-fitting, dry assembly and asking questions become necessary...and that's where the extra time will be invested. Actual hands-on time, plan on an extra 4-8 hours, total, with lots time waiting for questions to be answered and parts to arrive, in-between workbench sessions. It's really not daunting, as long as one is not trying to rush things.

In my experience, the overwhelming bulk of time & labor is spent cleaning & refinishing. With the required tools and experience, an engine can be torn down in under an hour. For me, assembly time varies greatly. With used parts, it's one or two pieces at time...a final shot of brakleen, a blast of compressed air, re-oiling, then into place. I always "dry fit" the lower end assembly, then verify that the transmission shifts properly and that neither it, nor the crank bind or have excessive endplay. From that point on, anything that might need to be R&Rd is straightforward enough. What sucks out loud is having to go back into the lower end after the rest of the engine...especially the top end...has been installed.

Once you dig into this project and have everything clean, ready-to-assemble, it'll make sense. Aside from the tranny/clutch assembly, these engines really aren't a lot more complicated than an OHV lawnmower engine.
 

mark from florida

Active Member
is it necessary to replace the kick start shaft. my bike only has 256 miles on it. looks to be in good shape. my thinking is with the bigger cc motor. will it make that much of a difference?
 

69ST

Well-Known Member
is it necessary to replace the kick start shaft. my bike only has 256 miles on it. looks to be in good shape. my thinking is with the bigger cc motor. will it make that much of a difference?
This may be a blessing in disguise. That mileage may, or may not, be accurate. Since you have to split the cases to swap in the new crank anyway, replacing a kickstarter shaft couldn't be easier. If you have a 3-speed transmission, source a "heavy duty" (a.k.a. 12v) kickstarter assembly from Dratv. The original kickstarter setup only engages half of the tooth width of the pinion gear, making it breakage-prone behind a stroker crank. The 12v version engages the full width of the gear and it's a constant-mesh design...only the ratchet moves along the kickstarter shaft.

Also, familiarize yourself with what shift forks should look like, when in perfect condition. The early shift forks (K0-K2) were prone to rapid wear. Honda superseded the original PN with an improved fork design. The contact pads, at the fork tips should look brand-new, complete with the original machining marks/pattern intact. Shift forks are easy to replace, while the cases are split; once assembled, it's no fun, at all.
 

Clayton

Active Member
I’m no expert by any means but my Clymer Repair manual was EXTREMELY helpful when I was rebuilding my 74 mini trail. I could not have done it without it for sure. Just for a side note I am not a mechanic by any means lol so maybe that’s why it was so helpful.
 

cjpayne

Well-Known Member
I have found that with any rebuild or repair, it pays to take LOTS of close up pics while tearing down.

The Clymners manual often left me in the dark, but does have some handy specs. In the Resources/Links section of this forum is some downloadable service and parts manuals. The parts catalog has some fiche's that come in quite handy sometimes.
 

MountainMini

Active Member
I got this manual (reprint) with my current 1977 project. P/O said he printed it from an online source. Then he sleeved all the pages and put it in a binder. Came with all the yearly supplemental updates/bulletins. Might be worth checking it out? I use my Clymer manual all the time too and it has definitely helped me out. Like CJ said some areas can leave you hanging and confused.
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