1969 Honda Z50 - Should brake light work withought key in ignition????

Discussion in 'General' started by 85CTrider, Jun 4, 2017.

  1. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    I have a 69 z50.. i just put on new parts from CHP.. ignition, wire harness, headlight, high low switch, cables etc..
    without the key in ignition all lights are off, but if i pull brake lever, brake lights work.
    once key is in and turned on, running light comes on and brakes still work. Is this normal??
    or should all power be cut off if no key is in??
    if this is wrong can someone tell me where the problem may lay??
    or if this is correct, any reason why they did that??
    any help would be great..
    thanks...
     
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  3. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    any ideas here to stop me from going crazy??
     
  4. power6994

    power6994 Member

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    Sounds like the key switch hasn't been earthed to the frame?

    Scratch paint of from under the key switch
     
  5. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    its original paint and not a newly painted bike.. should i still need to scratch off paint? is this the problem from not correct grounding of switch?
     
  6. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    so nothing should work with the key out??
    key in spot one does what? daytime
    key in spot 2 does what?? nighttime
     
  7. mini K1

    mini K1 Member

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    85CTrider, The Z50A k1 wiring harness, with its cable mounted brake light switches are configured before the ignition switch.

    The brake light will illuminate when either brake lever is used, with the battery connected and the ignition key removed.

    Ken in spot 1, allows you to start the bike.
    Key in spot 2, allows you to use the lights with the handlebar mounted dimmer switch.

    Z50A K1.jpg
     
  8. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    i hate to be a double checker on this one, but since i have just had two different responses, can someone with a 69 k1 tell me if the brake lights go on with battery connected and key out??? its all new to me... never had a z50 k1 before...
    thanks guys.. cant wait to hear....
     
  9. mini K1

    mini K1 Member

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    While you wait for the other k1 owners to respond, you may wish to double check and revisit the wiring diagram that I've enclosed in my previous post. It clearly depicts the fused red positive wire from the battery energizes the brake switches, before that wire goes to the ignition switch. My Z50A, k1 has been configured this way for the last 48 years.
     
  10. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    I think I need a vote or response from Kirbby or Racerx on this one.. i have a bet with a pal of mine. I told him this is how it works and he says... "oh ya.,.. after 50 years of how bikes are wires, they deiced to go and let the brake lights work after the battery is plugged in and no key is turned on... " he is trying to win this bet.. i need one more K1 owner to verify this.. then i will win my bet...
    i did see the diagram..... any explanation why they did this and not just run the power to the key first???
     
  11. Tweakin

    Tweakin Active Member

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    This is exactly how my recently restored K1's lights work.
     
  12. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    Ok.. im now convinced this is how they work.. any reason why they would do that and not just run power to the key first? i have a few other simple hondas and nothing works til key is turned on...
     
  13. kirrbby

    kirrbby Well-Known Member

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    If you look at the wiring diagram, you can see that the brake light switches are wired directly into the battery's positive side... red wire. So when you activate the brake light switch, it sends that power to the bulb, which is grounded thru the frame. So I'd say yes, the brake light switches are always hot, no matter where the key switch is positioned. The taillight is switched by the ignition switch.
     
  14. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    Hey Kirrbby.. do you have a Z50 K1? have you know this is how they work? any clue why its wired like that?? CT's dont do that do they?
     
  15. kirrbby

    kirrbby Well-Known Member

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    Looking again at the diagram...it don't look like the battery's negative side is grounded to the frame...until the switch is in the 2nd position..? So now, I do not think it should work with no key..? Soo...I dunno.

    No, I no longer have any K1 Z50's.
     
  16. kirrbby

    kirrbby Well-Known Member

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    Is your key switch a original? Aftermarket?
     
  17. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    after market key switch,,, but several guys say there bike has worked like that since original..
    how do we get to the bottom of this one???
     
  18. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    any further thoughts on this???
     
  19. Gary

    Gary Active Member

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    Just went out and checked my K1. I have an original replacement green case battery on the bike thats never had acid put in it and I have kept the fuse out also. So I connected a battery charger up to supply power. Brake lights do work with the key off! who would have thought.....
     
  20. 85CTrider

    85CTrider Member

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    Thanks Gary - OK guys.... i think we are coming to a conclusion here - looks like brake lights work with battery hooked up and key not in... -- maybe we all learnt something new here...
     
  21. racerx

    racerx Administrator
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    I'm not the resident Z50 expert here. That said, you have freshly-verified information from a longstanding member of our community and OEM wiring schematics both saying the same thing. That's about as conclusive as it gets, imho.
     

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