Spark plug wire question

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BlueGrassTornado

Member
OK, so I just picked up a couple 70 HK0's, and BOTH of them have all original components, including the coils and plug wires/caps. Here's the problem, the spark plug wires and caps on both are in HORRIBLE condition, literally fell apart in my hand, they obviously need replaced. So, is there any way to replace a spark plug wire without replacing the entire coil, and dropping the motor out? I did see a Video on Youtube where a guy shows it's "possible", but he also had to buy a 2 foot 10 mm wrench and that's not really appealing to me either. SURELY there has to be a better way! Not getting spark to either bike, haven't even looked at the points yet because these wires are in such horrible shape, can't see it would even pass a spark!!!!

 
OLD CT

OLD CT

Well-Known Member
Dratv has coils on sale for the ct70. $22.22 each. It really doesn't take long to drop the front of the engine down. Unplug the stator, remove the carb cap, boot, clutch cable, 2 exhaust stud nuts and the engine guard. Then take the front bolt out and let the engine sit down enough to change it. 1/2 hour tops.
 
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allenp42

Well-Known Member
If you're on a mission to repair what you have to retain the "original" coil, there are a couple of ways.

Aftermarket Coil
http://cart.hondanuts.com/Ignition-Coil-Honda-CT70K0-82-P3520172.aspx

Splice Kit
http://cart.hondanuts.com/NGK-Spark-Plug-Wire-Splice-Kit-Honda-Z50-CT70-SL70-QA50--P4182735.aspx

Wire
http://cart.hondanuts.com/Spark-Plug-Wire-7mm-Honda-Z50-CT70-SL70-QA50--P4182725.aspx

Or you can just buy the wire, cut the old wire off, twist/intertwine the 2 wires together such that have a gap of ~1/2 inch, solder them up, and fill the gap with good quality tape such as Scotch 33.

Easiest way is what OLD CT suggested. Not a lot be saved by repairing the coil nor a lot of $$ to purchase a new ready to plug and play. I have used all 3 methods in last couple of years.
 
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BlueGrassTornado

Member
Not sure what I'm going to do, probably bite the bullet and drop the engine and replace the entire kit and kaboodle. I'm telling you, these wires are original, and they're shot, broken in several places, cracked, frayed, just junk. I don't know what I would splice too, because there isn't any "good wire" left, and you would still have to remove the coil to replace it anyways, correct? You can't reach down under there, even with the gas tank out, and fashion any kind of repair on the end of the coil, correct? You've have to be a real magician to pull that off, I think I'll do it the conventional way. I actually found an NOS coil/wire/plug unit on eBay last night and bought it, and then ordered an aftermarket replacement also. I've got 2 H's, maybe I can get one of the original coils firing and not have to replace them both, like I've read before, it's very rare for the coil to actually fail, but that wiring is worn out as worn out can be, has to be replaced. No luck with spark on either so far. :(
 
cjpayne

cjpayne

Well-Known Member
Make sure the bolted surface is clean. It needs to ground. Also make sure that the engine to frame contact surfaces are clean too. After installing I always check the grounds with an ohm meter just to be sure. While you have the meter out, check the ignition switch to frame grounding too.
 
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BlueGrassTornado

Member
Well, did some more digging today and there was a nice mouse nest down in the frame! The big connector to the points was all green and nasty, it's no wonder it wouldn't fire, corroded all to heck. Now I'm going to replace the entire harness and the coil, do it right and be done with it. I'm sure it's going to take a few weeks but I'll post questions as I go!
 
kirrbby

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
When mice live in there they cause a lot of problems. You might want to drop the engine out of there and clean it up. Check to see how badly it's corroded under the nest. Check inside of the air filter. Check fuel lines, and see how badly the frame is rusted...maybe clean it up and protect it with some paint, oil, etc. Whatever the mice didn't eat, gets eaten by their urine. Best to find it all now.

BTW, they like ignition switch, and brake light switch wiring too.
 
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BlueGrassTornado

Member
There's definitely surface rust inside the frame in some areas, not any gaping holes and I've definitely seen much worse, how do you guys treat this kind of issue? This is actually the lower mileage of the two H's I just picked up, and it appeared to be the nicer of the two, but once I started tearing them apart, it seems the blue one that DIDN'T have a mouse nest in it, appears to be cleaner inside and the wiring is actually better too. I'm not going to do a complete nut/bolt/repaint restoration on either one, I'm just going to make sure it's got new wiring and electrical connections, leave the patina alone, make it run good and ride the crap out of it! But I'd like to do something in there so the surface rust doesn't get any worse. I know POR15 makes a good product but it would definitely be hard to get up in there with it. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
 
kirrbby

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
If the rust isn't heavy and flaking off, consider yourself...luckier.

I'd probably just wire brush as best I could, scratch rust out of the seams, then hose it with wd40. Same with the engine except use a fine brass brush...steel will scratch.
I think the little brass toothbrushes, plus wd40, works great for a quick engine cleanup.

Painting inside the frame...maybe just with some rustoleum, would probably be better for long term. But I'm pretty lazy for all that, and I'm not sure it's necessary now that you'll be lookin after those bikes...riding the crap out of them and such :)

Por15 might be pretty difficult to remove come repaint/restore time.
 
red69

red69

Well-Known Member
This may be more than you want to do, but this is what I did with an S90 frame. I used Evaporust to get to the inside. I made a dam out of ply and 2X's and filled it with plastic sheeting, pouring the Evaporust in the dammed up area.
 

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BlueGrassTornado

Member
cjpayne said:
Make sure the bolted surface is clean. It needs to ground. Also make sure that the engine to frame contact surfaces are clean too. After installing I always check the grounds with an ohm meter just to be sure. While you have the meter out, check the ignition switch to frame grounding too.
Click to expand...

Where are these grounds? Are you saying the coil itself needs to be grounded to the frame? I have replaced the entire wiring harness, everything up to the stator/points/condensor end of things. Have lights, power, no spark still. It still has the original coil in it, I can't reach it to get it out, I did replace buy one of those splicer sections with new wire/cap/plug. Still stumped. I have even tried to hook up another coil externally attached to the frame, and no spark from it either. Have a flywheel puller on the way. I guess I need to figure out which kind of points I have on these 70H models, I was told it could be either the Mitsubishi or Hitachi kind????
 
kirrbby

kirrbby

Well-Known Member
Not sure if it was mentioned yet or not, but do you have the battery in the bike?? Does the battery have the correct wire harness on it?? With the black loop of wire that makes the connection, engine to coil??

IMG_20170419_230436666.jpg
 
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allenp42

Well-Known Member
BlueGrassTornado said:
I have even tried to hook up another coil externally attached to the frame, and no spark from it either.
Click to expand...

What cjpayne is referring to in post no. 3, is the frame of coil needs to have a good, solid, and clean connection to the frame. Both the primary and secondary windings have a common connection to the coil frame. If you hooked up a 2nd coil and did not add a jumper from the frame of the coil to somewhere on the engine or frame of the bike, in short, the circuit is not complete. Put another way, the frame of the coil has to connect to the frame of the bike to complete the circuit.

This is a good check (hook up another good coil), if done properly, to rule out anything with the ignition switch or wiring harness. Coils rarely go bad, but the wire between the coil and spark plug is prone to break....especially close to where the spark plug cap screws into the plug wire.

If you have access to a meter, I would check the resistance of the primary winding (small black wire) and the plug wire. You need to check these one at at time with the other lead of meter on the coil frame. I have a spare coil and can provide you typical readings that you should see.
 
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BlueGrassTornado

Member
When I hooked up the aftermarket coil, I mounted it in one of the holes where the battery box normally screws into. The coil bolt went through and I attached a nut to it on the other side. Are you saying I need an additional wire, running from where I have this mounted on the frame, to another part of the frame for an additional ground? The only other connector of course is the black one going into the harness, and then the plug wire coming off itself. The entire reason I did this was to prove the coil was bad, hoping maybe it had a bad connection to the frame since it's kinda rusty down there.
 
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allenp42

Well-Known Member
BlueGrassTornado said:
Are you saying I need an additional wire, running from where I have this mounted on the frame, to another part of the frame for an additional ground?
Click to expand...

No. If you had the coil mounted to the frame, then you should be ok. It's starting to smell like points, condenser or both. About the only easy task left is to lightly sand the points using 400 grit sandpaper (or something close), and make sure the single bullet connector in the wiring for the stator plug is ok. Of course, I'm assuming low odds of you having 2 bad coils.

I've attached a pic of the "bullet connector". Most H stators have this. It's probably ok in yours, but since you mentioned "green" corrosion and "rats", it's something easy to check.
 

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BlueGrassTornado

Member
So I got the flywheel puller today and snatched that off pretty easily. Didn't see anything under there horribly out of whack, now I just need to figure out which tune up kit I need, points/condenser etc.......The flywheel has the number is FAX-1KL? Looks like one of those Mitisubishi icons on it, the triangle like thing. So I'm assuming this is NOT the Hitachi condensers I see mostly on eBay. Can somebody send me a link to the ones that I need for my H? At CHP or wherever, thanks!

PointsCT70.jpg
 
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allenp42

Well-Known Member
Here you go.

Condenser:
http://cart.hondanuts.com/Ignition-Condenser-Honda-CT70H-SL70-OEM-P5674269.aspx

Felt Pad:
http://cart.hondanuts.com/Ignition-Points-Felt-Honda-Z50-CT70-SL70-OEM-P5155742.aspx

Points - Aftermarket (K&S) or OEM Honda on this page.
http://cart.hondanuts.com/CT70-Electrical-Parts-C338584.aspx?sid=35985?s=Name ASC&p=1#


DRATV has them as well. OEM Honda condenser (item 9i @ $14.59)....and OEM Honda points. Aftermarket points are ok, but they are out of stock at this time.
http://dratv.com/noname157.html
 
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